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Triangle Tactical Podcast - Competitive Shooting, Mostly

Apr 7, 2018

I mentioned a theory on the podcast a couple weeks ago about how I expected that higher class shooters would probably pull away from lower class shooters on the shorter stages moreso than the longer stages, but gthat it was just a theory because I didn't want to do the math.

Well, I got an email from Louis, and he pulled the data from the different stages at the 2017 Production Nationals and...

I was totally wrong. 

Louis broke down the stages from Nationals, then charted the median percentage by round count on a chart and it turns out that the median finish from each classification was about the same on all the different round count stages.

Louis has been pulling the numbers on some other things with classifications and whatnot and if you want to see them, look in the shownotes for this episode and I'll have a link to his github page with the deets:

(By the way, if you didn't know this, you *should* be able to access all the links and stuff from the podcast shownotes in whatever podcast app you're using. I always tell you to go to or whatever, that's unnecessary for most of you, all the links should be right in your podcast app in the shownotes for this episode).

Why do people quit shooting?

Trying to think of people who I know who have actually just quit, vs those who have just not been to a match in a while for one reason or another, but have every intention to shoot again.

I've "quit" twice over the years.

- Ammo crunch after the 2012 Obama Election

- Hardcore burnout after ROing way too much

So, I emailed everyone on the Triangle Tactical email list and asked them if they've ever quit shooting, and why. I got a bunch of answers that are pretty wide ranging. (BTW, this is what I like to use the email list for, so if you're not on it, get on it!)

Interestingly, a bunch of people emailed me back and mentioned that cost probably makes some people quit, but nobody specifically emailed me back and said that they've quit because of cost.

Joe mentioned that he's in Michigan and the winters shut down most of the matches up there.

Jason and Khan mentioned time away from family. Some matches take a LONG time to get through, so I can see that. With a baby on the way, balancing matches and practice and family time is going to be something I need to put more emphasis on going forward.

Several folks mentioned jobs. Either job loss, or new jobs, or jobs taking up way too much time on the weekends. Aaron actually said that he quit a job because his days off were only during the week and he had to work every weekend so he changed it up to get his weekends off.

Quitting because the match near you isn't challenging. Aaron mentioned that quit because a local match jsut wasn't pushing him the way it needed to, took some time off and came back as a USPSA shooter where he's being challenged a lot more, and that's making things better for him.

Boring clubs. James mentioned a "looks the same every month" match that was near him years ago that drove him away.

A couple folks talked about physical injuries. Things that come from practice like tennis elbow, as well as other injuries that just keep them from shooting. Surgeries, etc.

So, with all this said, the reasons that people have quit shooting, lets talk for a minute about what's brought people back:

  • Friends
  • Needing a competitive outlet
  • Something to do with kids as they've gotten older and need more man skills.
  • Noticing that competition makes them want to be more athletic and get into better shape than they were previously.


"Why is there not a specific division for compact size firearms such as G19, CZ P01 or P07 etc?"

Here's the thing: we don't need carve outs for every size of firearm. If we were to do that we wind up with way too many divisions, and things just get silly after a while. 

In my opinion, the other reason for this is because most shooters don't want to shoot their little tiny guns in USPSA, at least not long term. 32rd stages with little guns that sometimes don't even hold 10 rounds doesn't really sound like a great time to me. I get that the guns mentioned all hold 10+ rounds, but if we're going to go down the tiny-gun rabbit hole, what about guns like the Shield, XDs, and others?

So, with all this said, I think the reasoning here is that USPSA isn't really interested in doing what IDPA does. IDPA has a place for these little guns, and they work really well in that game, because of round count, and because of the concealed carry sort of design of that game. 

All this isn't to day that USPSA doesn't have a place for the compact guns you mentioned though. All three guns you mentioned (Glock 19, CZ P01, and CZ P07) are specifically called out as legal on the USPSA Production list. There's nothing keeping these guns from being shot in Production, I see guys shoot Glock 19's in Production all the time. 

"Should competitors be allowed to shoot two divisions in the same match? I'm starting to see this a lot locally where people are shooting both handgun and PCC during the match (and paying two entry fees)."

No. We have a hard enough time getting shooters to help during the match, so letting someone shoot, then wander off to the safe area to bag a gun and un-bag another one, then come back to the stage, stuff mags full from the gun they just shot, check the gear for the gun that they're about to shoot, then shoot the second gun, then wander back to the safe area to switch back, stuff mags for the other gun, means that this person will NEVER run the timer or work the tablet. They'll NEVER paste target for more than a shooter or two per stage if we're lucky, and then they're taking up more time by shooting the second gun. 

With that said, if there's a multi-day match and shooters can shoot different divisions on different days, no problem.

There's also a local BUG match that allows multiple entries, and for that match it works really well. The stages are 5rds tops. No reloads, and no holster needed, so you can finish your first gun, bag it, and take your second gun out of it's bag when it's time to shoot. Easy peasy, and it works just fine because there isn't much pasting and resetting to do, so there is time for people to switch guns at that match.